Rockies lineup vs. Braves, 7/7
The Colorado Rockies lineup Thursday against Atlanta Braves right-hander Tim Hudson:
LF Charlie Blackmon
SS Jonathon Herrera
1B Jason Giambi
RF Seth Smith
2B Mark Ellis
3B Ian Stewart
CF Ryan Spilborghs
C Chris Iannetta
SP Juan Nicasio
OMG! When I looked at this lineup this is what, literally, popped into my head.
AAA
AAA+
Old
Legit
Legit
AAA-
Nope
Overrated
Rising
Six starters who, IMO, wouldn’t be starting anywhere except for the Rox…two legitimate ML’ers and one, potentially viable, starter.
Today a slaughter or do we opine, “how in the hell did we win that game?”
We’ll know in about four hours or so.
What a line up! Normally a day like today would be interesting to see young kids play, like a spring training game….except most of our backups we all know what they have and it ain’t much.
I can’t believe I put hope in this team after the way they gave up last September. What a fool am I!
What lineup would you put out? Tulo and Cargo are hurt. This is pretty much all they can run out at the moment. I would probably have Todd playing but that’s about all I would change with Tulo and Cargo out.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m not complaining about Tracy’s decision. He has the pieces he has. Nothing else to do.
My complaint is more of 1)failure of guys like Dexter, Nelson, EYJ, to develop into servicable backups. 2)failure of Stewart and Iannetta to become formidable offensive players and 3)failure of Dan O’Dowd from moving any of those previously mentioned players for something that is formidable.
On a lot of other teams the non-stars can sometimes carry a team for a few games here and there. This team doesn’t have that, and as good as Helton and Smith have been overall this year, neither of them have put together monster games.
I’m just curious, and not trying to be confrontational. If Uggla and Heyward were on this team what would everyone’s opinions be. Uggla cost a bunch and is hitting below .200 (Lopez). Heyward has hit the sophomore wall and is, well, underperforming (Stewart, Fowler). I have been very critical of Lopez, Stewart and Fowler. Just wondering how other posters view other teams apparent failures. Braves do have the luxury of having people who should perform (Mcann, Chipper) and a overpowering pitching staff. Ours would have been there IF UJ was 2010 version, DLR was not hurt, Chacin was more consistent, Hammel is Hammel, and Nicasio replaced Cook (and other 5th starters).
Helton is 9-13 lifetime against Hudson. Sure, its hard to argue against Giambi’s production this year, but the guy that is gonna spell Helton needs to be RH. Maybe I’m just an unhappy fantasy owner, Helton has sat so many times this year against pitchers that he has good #’s against. Granted, this team has bigger problems than this, I just get so frustrated watching Giambi. He is the worst defensive 1B I’ve ever seen. Every game he fails to make plays that people on this website could make. A lot of times they aren’t counted as errors. Sorry for the rant, just frustrated.
This pitching staff is out of control.
You can’t keep throwing fast ball after fast ball this kid Nicasio
needs 1 or 2 more pitches.
I agree completely. He doesn’t have enough pitches to get through a ballgame. He also doesn’t have the coaching either.
The ATL announcers are simply blasting Nicasio and if what they are witnessing in this 3rd inning is any indication he needs to be yanked before he throws his arm out of its socket.
He’s also a complete headcase right now trying to pick off every runner like 4 times. Get your focus on the damn hitter.
This meek and timid (SCARED) attitude by all the Rockies pitchers is humiliating and it follows in line with the coaching staff. Apodaca needs to go.
The book on Juan, as currently consituted, has too few pages and has been read by everybody he will face.
Not fair to him to be up here right now.
Thank goodness he is being yanked.
I just checked gameday after reading these comments. Can’t say I totally blame Nicasio. He has been pressed into service and he should still be in AA working on those secondary pitches. Which begs the question, if he needs work on secondary pitches, what has Apodaca been teaching him (or not) all these weeks? What happened to Blackmon?
The.death march continues. Braves look good. Who do I turn to, Atl or Det?
Not sure what happened to Charlie. I assume he pulled something running the bases.
The ATL announcers were criticizing Nicasio for throwing to 1st bases several times for every runner during the third unning. They thought he was more concerned about the runners than the hitters. Subsequently they unleashed 6 straight hits.
He’s been doing that a lot lately too. He doesn’t focus on the hitter and he’s making the game go way longer than it should and screws up the pace.
Mark Ellis coming down to Earth very quickly
this team is so embarrassing. I just feel stupid being duped into thinking this team was better than a .500 team.
It will be a miracle if this team wins more than 75 games this year.
ATL announcers are completely blasting this Rockies team. Making fun of their posture on the field, lack of communication, and futility on offense.
hahaha there is the great defense at third…..
The team has quit on Tracy and that is not a good situation for all these youngsters to be coming into, hence the struggle. You can blame the injuries to Tulo and Cargo all you want, but the truth is this has been going on for much longer. If what progmatinee says is true, we must be the joke of the league. Tracy needs to go.
As others have said, the Rockies look absolutely horrible today with my guy Stewie leading the pack. His stance seems more open than ever, and with the slow pitch beer league softball swing, he reminds me of Hawpe (without all the noise) and we know what happened to him. …Ooops, my guy Stewie just made an error……. What he needs is a session or more with Kevin Long of the Yankees to atraighten him out….assuming he would listen…..since his shortcomings are obvious to even a layman.
When it rains, it pours….Blackmon has a fractured left foot so the Brave announcers tell us.
Was there a soul on Earth, including Jim Tracy and the players that thought the Rockies had any chance in winning this game once they fell behind 5-2?
I don’t think so, and thats the problem. The Rockies don’t believe in themselves and I would argue that quiting has been on this team’s collective mind for a month and that the Cargo injury was the prime opportunity to just give in and give up.
PS just heard Charlie has a fractured bone in his foot.
Yep its all Stewart’s fault, let’s go blame him. This guy saves more runs defensively than he lets in by errors. He gets to balls that Wiggington couldn’t dream of. No, he hasn’t gotten the hits yet but at least he is putting the balls in play consistently, which is a lot better than what he did before. Give the guy a break. We are losing this game because of pitching, again, not hitting (although hitting can always be better)
Prog,
They quit last Sept and have never recovered.
Agree, E.
I really dramacized last year’s September as it was happening, and then during the offseason I kinda forgot about it and found hope with their great Spring.
But I think I was more right than I knew in September. This team is mentally weak. They can’t handle any kind of pressure whatsoever. And I hate to say it, but as their leader, I fear Tulo is at the center of it all.
Awesome popup with the bases loaded. Why do our hitters love popups?
LOL. ATL announcers continuing to rail on Rockies. Called Ian Stewart and Spilly sleeping. And they were right. How do you not move up on wild pitch?
Pretend that the bases are empty Ty! lol
Just heard on KOA about Stewart sitting still on the WP. What is up with him? I wish someone on the coaching staff would start getting on him.
onother of those situations were wiggy has bases loaded and will strikeout or fly out or ground out,
and so he did….
who its gonna be called up if blackmon is injured?
Have to play for 2012, so bring up Fowler.
I think everyone knew the outcome there
I take solace in how short the beer lines are going to be for the rest of the season
That would be great except O’Dowd and the Monforts will cite decreased second half attendance for their inability to sign anyone next year.
Looks like Tracy needs to go. I know the injuries are an excuse now but, as has been said, the Rox have been sucking long before that and now they are just pathetic. Totally lifeless. Heads have to roll… I am thinking All-Star break they clean house with Apodaca going along with Tracy and Lansford now that our starters get shelled in the early innings and our relievers can’t seem to throw a scoreless inning. Unbelievable. It’s either cleaning house or just accepting that we are playing for 2012 and start shopping Wiggington and (I hate to say, but in terms of what’s most beneficial to winning next year) Helton for some future talent.
Looks like we are sinking faster than the sinker on the fishing line. Might as well forfeit the weekend games in D.C. And send them back to Salt River Fields for an extended training during the break. Break camp with a new set of 25 best players on the roster.
You’re going to eat Helton’s salary anyway, he’s not going to get too much in return. You have no 1st base prospect to speak of. No point in moving Helton unless Helton tells you he wants to go.
Ok guys, if you are getting that sinking feeling, think there is too much negativity in posts, enabarassed, feel stupid, and the list goes on and on, why bother watching? Nothing is going to change anytime soon. Nothing. You will continue to be frustrated at least thru the break. Minimum.
Now Blackmon is out for weeks.
Make no mistake about it. This should have been a very good team. This team had plenty of depth. Yes Mr. O’Dowd rolled the dice and gambled with a few but if they did work out he and the team would be riding high right now. And please spare me with it’s all about the money.
From where I sit, my questions are directed to the coaching staff. No they can’t take the field or hit for the players. I understand that. They DO need to be able to get them motivated or get their heads in the right place. For whatever reason I just don’t see that happening right now. Am I saying get rid of all the coaches? Not necessarily but they need to have serious team meeting and everyone needs to have their say.
Something needs to happen. They need to come back from the break on fire.
Helton doesn’t want to go. Are you guys serious? He only belongs in one uniform and that is in a Rockies uniform!
In other news… The Rockies say they need to play better… aint happening so far… They talk the talk they dont walk the walk. How long does this last?
And another injury with Charlie Blackmon hurt for 3 weeks.
I can pick on Tracy — and he has made some maddening decisions — but the truth is that the Braves are simply more talented. And that was obvious to anyone who watched this series. The primary reason? Good drafts. O’Dowd and Co. whiffed on too many picks (Nelson, Reynolds, Weathers come to mind) and they’re getting burned by it.
At least DOD hit HRs drafting Tulo and trading for CarGo and DLR. We can’t put all blame on DOD.
The Rockies need to trade for some good pitchers next year, If you don’t have arm’s that can get guys out your going to struggle no matter how good your offense is.
O’Dowd will always have Tulo. Similar to how Kiki Vandeweghe will always have Carmello.
They fell into their laps. I suppose he could have made a big mistake then as he did with Nelson, Reynolds, Stewart and others.
My problem is that more than any other team I can think of the Rockies players flame out and O’Dowd misses the opportunity to get a return.
Even the Pirates were able to get something for Jason Bay and Nate McClouth, both are shadows of who they were. The Rockies don’t have much to show for 2 guys in Atkins and Hawpe who put up similar numbers for a time.
I just always feel that the Rockies overpay in trades and never get the better end of the bargain.
I was traveling all day and caught the score a couple of times between flights. Sounded like an ugly day.
I think it’s time to sink or swim with the youngsters (or in some case middle age youngsters). Bring Dexter back up, play him, play Stewart and Chris Nelson. Bring back G. Reynolds. They can’t do any worse than what we are seeing. See what you can get for Wiggington, Ellis, Giambi, Betancourt, Spilly, Cook, etc. Some of those guys won’t bring. Somebody would probably overpay for Todd near the trade deadline or late in August but I believe he has veto power and he would probably say no. And who could blame him. Maybe even Smith. Get some prospects.
As many of you say this is an under-achieving team. Somebody needs to pay, other than us fans. Frankly I would bring in a whole new coaching staff starting with a manager who will demand performance, a pitching coach who can actually get one of our starting pitchers to have more than one good year, a hitting coach who can help the team hit both at home and on the road and somebody who can teach these guys to run the bases.
I;m going to have another tequila.
Bill,totally agree.Play who we have and decide if they have a future here.Send the unready[Nicasio,Blackmon,Brothers]backdown to improve their skills now that they’ve had a taste,and for god’s sake find,steal,develop ,trade for some PITCHING!
“for god’s sake find,steal,develop ,trade for some PITCHING!”
Of all the things that have gone wrong this year…and we all know a LOT has gone wrong, why focus on the pitching? It’s been a relative strength of the team. When you adjust for park (Coors still inflates offense significantly, even with the humidor), the pitching has been above league avg, and that’s with two of the projected 5 starters having significant injuries. In contrast, the hitting has been below average overall, with 2nd, 3rd, and LF performance well below league avg.
Goodness gracious! I am out of the country for a couple of weeks on work stuff (evidently the concept of a working wi-fi system is one only Americans and the Far East have heard of at this point, so I was totally out of touch for two+ weeks) and the team falls apart at the seems…what have you all been doing? Let me join in by saying this…the season barring another run for the ages propelled by aliens landing and taking over the bodies of our players, is over.
But lets not go overboard. No one could have predicted that Ubaldo, who has made steady improvement since 07 would pitch like a 1st time AA call-up into July. No one could have predicted that DLR would be lost for the season. When the season began the Rox 1-3 on paper were in that next tier behind the Phils and Giants, right there will the Braves. Has not happened.
No one expected both Tulo and CarGo to struggle for 2 months to find their stroke. Then to get injured (okay maybe Tulo, but the CarGo injury looked like pure hustle).
I had picked Dex for the breakout candidate of the year for the league, maybe even his first AS. Wow got that wrong, like Ubaldo he went backwards. As for the rest of the under 30 home-drafted core, Ian, Nelson, Herrera, and Young simply have flopped. Cannot say why. You expect at least a couple of them to hold their own, especially Ian (come on, a guy who has hit 25 bombs in the bigs should get more than 3 hits in 3 months). I still think CDI has been a solid catcher and his bat has gone soft since he lost back-up protection. He will never be Joe Mauer, but he is as good or better than 16-20 guys out there (yes, says something about catching today).
I do not blame DOD. He re-signed CarGo and Tulo, and last year this site was full of “enjoy them while we have them” comments asking whether a trade in 2013 or 2014 was likely. He resigned DLR when most thought he was gone. They signed Wiggy for a decent deal in a year with few big RH bats and a spiraling cost (still wonder if they should not have tried going after Jermaine Dye). As for the drafts, a lot of those failures are injury related, especially Whethers and Reynolds, with Nelson also hurt by that. The last couple of years shows some real promise (again, check out what Wheeler is doing in AA and the promise of Rex Brothers, Blackmon already has made it in quick time). Drafting is not a science.
So where from here? The season is likely over (will still try and take in some games because in the end, baseball is just great, especially on a nice night or Sunday afternoon). When they are healthy CarGo and Tulo are worth seeing at least a couple of times more. I have not read anything to say Dex deserves to be back up here yet, and the recall of Garner seems to point to that. The AS break is taking forever to get here, and I wonder if both Tulo and CarGo should shut it down til after the AS break. I think you do have to give Stewart time at 3B, at least til the end of July. Same with Ellis (that was a trade that totally suprised me when I got back…does the guy really have anything left in the tank?). The core of Tulo, CarGo, Helton (for 2012) and Smith does not look horrible (is Smith in line for a move to 1B…I thought I read that somewhere).
The pitching needs to get fixed. DAC has done a nice job overall this season considering the troubles. There is not a lot of help immediately coming. Nicasio could use more time in AA, but this time should help him a lot long-term. Chacin has it in him, though probably not as good as 1st half indicates. Probably more of a mid 3 ERA kind of guy. Cook, sad to say as a fan, is probably riding his last rodeo, and if they had another other real options I have a feeling they would have moved already. At this point Hammel probaly is either trade bait (he has a live arm, could be effective out someone’s pen/spot starter in a pennent race) or pen material (assuming there was anyone to take his spot). If Ubaldo is not hurt (and I hope the team takes the break to stick him in a CT, a MRI and every other device to look for structural damgage), then he simply needs to treat the next three months as winter ball.
Some of you has talked about it, so I will. Is Jim Tracy the man to lead this team forward? I like the guy a lot based on what we see on television. He did win a manager of the year just two years ago. But his history is to go backwards after initial success. Have the players quit? Does this feel a lot like April of 09 with Clint? Has Tracy done what is necesary to help young players to grow and develop up here (remembering that outcomes are out of his contol, same with our hitting coaches). If they keep Tracy the rest of the year and the offseason, then the first 45 games of 2012 will be key. Should Carney stay? Again, he cannot be blamed for guys decision to chase pitches and to swing that lovely pop-up swing. Can he help the young guys? If so, he stays. If not, or if his work has caused problems with the big guys, then he goes.
Baseball breaks your heart. What you see in March and even April can be a mirage, or it can simply be done in by slumps and injuries. This team was the best coming out of ST, I hold to that. In a weak division even marginal play could have won this season. Now we are left wondering if Spilly, Hammel, Stewart, Lindstrom and Street might have some value come three weeks.
But…if they win this final series against the Nats, if they come out of teh AS break and go 7-3…well, I still have my rose coloured glasses. 162 games means its a long season. Maybe the Rox are only mostly dead!
Ataboy Doc C had me wondering where those purple glasses were hiding all this time! Might be jumping the gun just a tad, however DanO must have a great off season, or it will be time to say adios amigo!
Well stated Dr. Christopher. Only disagreement I have is Huston Street. He’s done nothing but save games. Yes a few hiccups here and there but what reliever goes through the whole season flawlessly?? My only issue with him is health issues every other season.
rockymountainhigh, the only reason I included Street, whom I like a lot and has been solid this season, is that he has value, a contract that is heavy for a sub .500 team but still moveable, and could actually bring some return in terms of talent. I would prefer not to move him (especially without any clear replacement). Not a slight at Street, only recognizing that his move might help the team in terms of salary and prospects.