Tigers join Jimenez hunt
FoxSports.com’s Ken Rosenthal reports that the Detroit Tigers have inquired about Colorado Rockies starter Ubaldo Jimenez, who is being sought by at least five teams despite the Rockies’ high asking price. According to Rosenthal, the teams interested in Jimenez and some of the players the Rockies like on those teams:
- Tigers: Right-handed pitcher Jacob Turner, a 2009 first-round pick and the Tigers’ top prospect. He’s 3-5 with a 3.48 ERA as a 20-year-old in Double-A.
- Boston Red Sox: Right-handed pitcher Kyle Weiland and third baseman Will Middlebrooks. Weiland is a 2008 third-rounder, who is 8-7 with a 3.15 ERA at Triple-A. Middlebrooks is a 2007 fifth-rounder having a breakout year at Double-A, where he is hitting .308 with 14 home runs and 61 RBI.
- New York Yankees: Catcher Jesus Montero and right-handed pitcher Dellin Betances and Ivan Nova. Montero was rated the eighth-best prospect in the minors in Baseball America’s midseason top 50 and is considered one of the best hitting prospects in baseball. Betances was ranked the Yankees’ third-best prospect by BA before the season. He’s 4-4 with a 3.20 ERA at Double-A and is considered a potential frontline starter or future closer. Nova, ranked 13th in the Yankees system by BA, is 8-4 with a 4.12 ERA in 17 games with the Yankees in 2011.
- Cleveland Indians: Left-handed pitcher Drew Pomeranz, a 2010 first-round pick who is 3-3 with a 1.98 ERA at two levels and has reached Double-A in his first professional season.
- Cincinnati Reds: First baseman/outfielder Yonder Alonso, a 2008 first-rounder who is blocked at first by Joey Votto and was recently recalled to play in the outfield after hitting .296 with 12 home runs and 56 RBI at Triple-A. The Rockies would also want at least one major-league-ready pitcher likely from a previously reported list that included Mike Leake, Homer Bailey and Travis Wood.
A deal for Jimenez remains a longshot as the Rockies reportedly have not backed off their demands for three top prospects, one of which would include a potential frontline starter who could join the rotation in 2012 at the latest and likely an impact hitter. Potential suitors, meanwhile, have remained reluctant to pay the Rockies’ price.
This is becoming very interesting, but we need something more concrete then potential minor league stars, would not trade jimenez for this
No trade is good enough. He will be back to form next year putting up lee/haladay/tim type of numbers for many many years. Trading him is BS. Prospects rarely pan out in relation to his kind of talent.
I agree with you Jaredean. If… IF!… one of the pitchers mentioned above fullfilled his potential, and we got an impact bat in the process, then trading Ubaldo would be a win for the Rockies. But that “IF” is just too big a problem in my mind. We have an ace looked into a below-market-value contract already – which is exactly what mid market teams dream of – and should stick with that. Plus – and I know this shouldn’t officially matter, but I can’t help it, it does – Ubaldo is a likable guy, a fun to root for guy, and want him in a Rockies uniform.
The only list of players that sounds appealing to me is the Reds.
And to be honest, trade Ubaldo (at this point in his career) and I’d really lose interest in paying to see this franchise. I’m sure it would be that way for many others as well… Dan O’Dowd might want to factor that in his calculations.
Middlebrooks is hitting .308 with 14 HR and 16 RBI??? Is that stat right? So he only hits solo homeruns then I guess.
return to what form he had 15 good starts in half a year, he is a good starter but not an ace, rockies fans value him too high
I’m in the same boat as 40DegreesNorth. After O’Dowd has arguably shed his bad rep after getting rid of all of our stars in his early days, and building “some” respect since 2007, trading Ubaldo would be a deal breaker for me in retaining interest in this team for a spell. My emotional commitment has already taken a big hit this season and I’ve not been watching many of the games of late.
Hope O’Dowd’s paying attention to us.
I’m not in favor of trading Jimenez, but I do remember a lot of people saying they would never go see the Rockies again when there was talk of trading Matt Holliday a few years ago. Personally, I want the Rockies to be good when I pay to see them and the right deal might make them better. I would hate to see Jimenez go, but I’m willing to wait to see what, if any, deal happens before I trash it.
I went through that with losing Matt Holliday. It will depend on who they get in return and what they do with it, whether I can accept the trade.
I still feel that if you don’t trade Ubaldo and you don’t sign him to an extention, he is going to be 1 unhappy camper and not sure how that will impact the team.
On the other hand, is everyone here ready to brace themselves for signing another current player to a long term deal? These long term deals only secure players, it doesn’t improve the team.
We’re no better than a .500 with all these guys. At some point they need to invest money into improving the team, not just holding onto the status quo.
The Rockies don’t have to trade Ubaldo to make me happy, but if this team goes into 2012 with practically the same starting lineup as they did in 2011 I will not be happy.
Another offseason of FISH (now IFS) talk and then another April, May, June of yo-yo’ing AAAA players…I just can’t take that again.
We need to go in with some certainty of who will play and who will not.
For some reason trading a pitcher like Ubaldo is different than a slugger like Holliday. Guess it’s the fact the Rox have had so many impact bats in the past and not many quality starters. So in my head it’s a different animal. And I admit Ubaldo still is a work in progress and has to prove himself still. He still hasn’t put together a consistent season here, but we’ve seen what he’s capable of…
To me, if comes down to what Prog mentioned. If the Rockies go into 2012 with the same basic lineup, the season is going nowhere. They need another impact hitter, and if they can get one with a slight downgrade in the rotation, I’m willing to listen. Problem is that no one team has what the Rockies need. If they could get, say, Jesus Montero from the Yankees, Homer Bailey from the Reds and Jacob Turner from the Tigers, that’s something worth considering — a middle of the lineup hitter and two potential front-of-the-rotation starters. Not sure, though, that one team has the right pieces. The Rockies can’t trade Jimenez and miss on the players they get back.
Put me in the trading Ubaldo is lunacy camp. At a minimum, a top shelf starter whose best years are still ahead. Not too much of a stretch to see him as the Ace of the staff for the next 5 years or more.
Pitchers of this quality don’t grow on trees and we will never be able to sign one in free agency. Letting him go and hoping you catch lightning in a bottle ala Cargo sounds like a move made from desperation not inspiration.
And don’t get me wrong I’m with you guys about not having the same basic roster next year. Some changes *need* to be made…obviously. :-)
Still not seeing a deal worth making.
Ubaldo is a much bigger piece than a position player like Matt Holliday. The Giants and Phillies have first-class pitching staffs… the road to glory passes though them.
The Rockies are right to stick to their high asking price. But if someone is willing to pay that price, then make the trade.
Many of us knew they needed an impact bat prior to the 2011 season. DOD should read ITR and take our advice. Lol.
Steve makes a really interesting point. No single team can get this done. So, is the reason this has gone quiet is they are looking for a third team, someone like the Mariners who need bats and lots of them, or some other team. I can see this happening if its a three team (four even) to get the parts going everywhere.
Steve I know the Rockies would also look at Ivan Nova or Phil Hughes from the Yankees, Rick Porcello or Max Scherzer from the Tigers, and Yondser Alonso, Mike Leake, Travis Wood, or Homer Bailey from the Reds… Who would the Rockies look at in a trade package from the Red Sox, Blue Jays, or Indians that already has some big league experience or is this trade for three top prospects?
Miketober I agree with you about Dan O’Dowd coming over and reading our advice here on ITR.
Either path – trade or no trade – involves risks, but personally, I’d rather HOPE that a roster much like the one we currently have improves next year than HOPE that some hot-shot prospect or two makes up for the (relatively) known commidity we already have in Ubaldo. By “improve,” all we’d need are the two very realistic scenarios of LDR’s return from injury and Ubaldo’s return to form to make a HUGE difference next year.
The trade I DO want to happen (other than Spilbourghs and other replacement player types) is a trade of Street. Even if we don’t get much back from him in terms of prospects, I’d like that $7M (or at least a good chunk of it) to spend on someone else next year, with Brothers/Lindstrom a good-enough-with-the-potential-to-be-better replacement in hand.
meant De La Rosa by LDR, of course. My Bad.
I’m going to the Rockies-Nats game Thursday night and I am hopeful #38 will be on the mound. Unless they make a guaranteed sensational haul in dealing Ubaldo, I would prefer he stay right where he is. His potential and ridiculously team-friendly contract make an awfully strong case to keep him. The only caveat is that the team knows something about his struggles this season that has not been made public and which would success long-term success may be problematic.
The other issue to consider is that the same man who may decide what players the Rockies want in exchange for Jimenez is someone whose track record in assessing talent has not been so great lately.
To trade something you’ve always wanted and never had – a top-of-the-rotation starter is foolish and ungrateful unless the return on moving him is so extraordinary.
The Indians once moved Bartolo Colon and in exchange got a future Cy Young pitcher in Cliff Lee, a great SS prospect Brandon Phillips who is an excellent pro hitter with the Reds now, and Grady Sizemore, who would be a star if he could stay healthy consistently.
That kind of deal proved successful. Most don’t. You better be sure you’re getting quality and quantity to make this work. Ubaldo is being undervalued around the league now because his work is less impressive than last year but he’s going to rebound next season. Dan O’Dowd has to hold firm on the price, not panic and sell low.
Rockies Prospects and Futures
Joel Sherman says via tweet.
“#Rockies mad at Jimenez because out shape in spring, upset CarGo/Tulo got huge deals and he didn’t, has shut off pitch coach Apodaca”
My hunch, and its just a hunch:
Shape, I didn’t see anything obvious. The guy has notoriously OVER excersised. I don’t believe it.
Upset at Cargo and Tulo deals, his lack of deal. I believe it. Carrot gets dangled since before Spring 2010. Amazing 1st half. No deal. Hype hype hype about deal during second half. Nothing. Resign DLR for big money. Too much money. Nothing for Ubaldo. Rumors start off about Chacin getting deal. Stil no Ubaldo deal. Wouldn’t we all be upset if people got raises around us while we didn’t?
Shutting off Apodaca…I believe it. He’s too fatherly and soft. Need pitching coach that will be in a players ear when they falter.
I think it’s a game of chicken and we’ll see who blinks first. If DoD has the onions to stick to his guns, then the worst that can happen is Ubaldo is still a Rockie. If it comes down to Sunday morning, especially if Ubaldo pitches well on Saturday, then it’s likely somebody will give the Rockies what they want. My question is why they think they need a catcher. I’ve been hearing that the guy in Tulsa will come up soon anyway and while Pacheco will probably end up 3rd or 1st, having a good player who can be a 3rd catcher would be the ultimate card in the hole.
Frankly we need to come away with two or three great pitching prospects and one or two other good prospects.
And make some better decisions during the off-season. John Maine didn’t work out. The Yankees signed both Bartolo Colon and Freddy Garcia as minor league free agents during the winter (or probably the spring) and they have been their 2nd and 3rd best starters this year.
One thing about this whole trade scenario that bothers me is that the man making (or not making) the trade is DoD and he might not even be here next year.
Prog, that Sherman tweet strikes me as made-up b.s. Ubaldo is a notoriously hard worker. I think he just stated that he probably should’ve pitched winter ball as he has in other off seasons. My guess is the Rockies thought he was putting too much offseason mileage on his arm and encouraged him not to. At any rate, he clearly has his stuff back, so whatever it is I’m not really worried anymore.
Steve, this club needs to make some changes, but let’s be realistic: this was just one of those years in which a bunch of things went wrong, from DLR and Cook going down to a lot of players simply having down years. Nothing astonishing about that, and no reason to believe that a lot of the same players won’t have up years in 2012. If Ellis stays, then position-wise we’d best be looking for a righthanded-hitting third baseman and a righthanded-hitting outfielder. Too many guys in the primes of their careers, including CarGo, Tulo, Ubaldo, to start a big rebuilding project.
One thing that continues to bother me: why sit Seth Smith vs. lefties? It’s one thing when you think you have somebody who can hit lefties better and play a decent outfield. But when your options are Wiggy dropping flyballs in LF or EY Jr making outs and circling around flyballs what’s to lose? Don’t you want to give Smith a chance in this lost season to show that he can be an everyday player?
I agree on playing Smith, but he did have an extraordinarily bad July both in the OF and at the plate. He might just be getting a little more rest right now.
I don’t believe trading Ubaldo (which, for the record, I am still against and think is a huge longshot to happen) would be a rebuilding project. I don’t think this year is a year in which everything just went wrong. Certainly that’s the case to some extent with the rotation, but two key components of the Rockies’ system have just flat failed to develop — Fowler at leadoff, Stewart in the No. 5 spot. That is having an enormous impact throughout the lineup, and the gap left by bad drafts in 2006, 2007 and, to a lesser extent, 2008 are being felt this year, both in terms of talent available on the field or to trade for the pieces the Rockies need. If — and this remains a big if because I think only the Indians have the right mix of players to make a deal that makes sense for the Rockies — the Rockies could address multiple issues by trading Jimenez, then I’m willing to consider it because I don’t see the players they need available in free agency next year and players like EY, Stewart and Fowler are going to bring only marginal returns in trades. Not long ago, trades were made to help both teams (in theory, anyway) not help one while the other rebuilt. Trading Jimenez would be that sort of deal if it happened. It would be to make them better now, not three years from now, by addressing multiple holes in the team. It’s why the Rockies aren’t looking at Class A prospects. They are looking at prospects, but only those at Double-A and higher, who would be able to help next year.
The story about the Rockies being upset with Jimenez is BS and a non-story. It’s a story that got started on the East Coast and continues to be perpetuated in the incestuous world of sportswriters. It is simply not an issue. There was never talk of extending Jimenez before this season. It was always something the Rockies planned to address after this season.
Not sure if anyone saw the link I posted to a story that Tom Verducci wrote this morning. “History says Rockies would be wise to move Ubaldo Jimenez now”
Steve, I see you already have the link to MLB trade rumors. Interesting that it is being alleged the Rockies plan on re-signing Mark Ellis. I think this is a good move, if it’s true.
What I find hard to do in talking about this is separating sentiment from baseball judgement. On the one hand, I don’t want the Rockies to trade Jimenez because I love watching him pitch. On the other hand, I want the team to win and some big holes have been exposed this year. There’s a decent wave of prospects coming in 2013 or so like Wheeler, Arenado, Rosario, Friedrich, Bettis and Parker, but how do you address those holes and stay competitive until then without giving up something substantive?
I think the Rockies do like Ellis and there’s a decent chance he comes back, but that rumor is purely one reporter citing another reporter at this point.
I’m curious if an Iannetta trade will occur, and what it could result in. At one time Iannetta was rumored for the Pirates, but boy is Mike McHenry playing well right now. He’s exactly the type of grinder that Rockies could use on a day in and day out basis. He is what Yorvit Torrealba was for the 2007 Rockies.
Prog, I think at this point there are multiple “insiders” claiming multiple knowledge of multiple teams having interest in multiple Rockies. Seems like about a 3rd of the team is alleged to be going somewhere.
Last I heard was Iannetta may be headed to SD. Could be an interesting weekend.
I’m not sure what the fascination is with Mark Ellis. He’s a good player but since he’s been here he hasn’t made the Rockies a better team. Except for his first series when he was great, he has just been ok. If we can get younger value for him why not trade him. He’s not 25 or even 30, he’s 34. When the Rockies traded for him, Rocks were still in the race. Can’t be many of you who still think the Rockies are still in the race. Maybe I should be smoking or drinking what you are.
Next year Ellis will still be what he is now. A decent 2nd baseman, but a year older.
Good call on Mike McKenry, Prog. He is turning into a folk hero in Pittsburgh for his terrific all-out effort on defense, which has earned him the wonderfully appropriate nickname of “Fort” after Fort McHenry, which protected Baltimore during the War of 1812 and today is a national monument. In other words, nothing gets past the “Fort.”
In addition, he’s hitting .264 in 110 at-bats and has significantly contributed to the Pirates’ stunning season in his month-plus in Pitssbirgh. Hurdle can’t say enough nice things about him and indeed he would look really good in a Rockies’ uniform. Chalk up another incorrect assessment to DOD. At the bare minimum he would give the Rox two decent catchers, if not emerge as a starter, thus making Iannetta expendable.
I don’t know who the Indians would want for Jimenez if they want him so bad besides Alex White… Would the Rockies want Carlos Santana, Matt LaPorta, Justin Masterson, Fausto Carmona?
Who would the Rockies want from Boston??? What are your predictions as far as possible moves on Sunday…
Hunter Pence?
Ubaldo Jimenez?
Heath Bell?
Jason Marquis?
Man I would do Ubaldo, Stewart and Iannetta for Carlos Santana. Maybe more. That guy is a stud. No way the Tribe trades him.
Phillies get Hunter Pence and arguably hold on to their two best prospect arms – Jesse Biddle and Trevor May. The Phillies did give up their top hitting prospect in Jonathan Singleton and their alleged top pitching prospect, Jared Cosart. Pence is a very solid player, a difference maker for Philadelphia but not an elite talent.
Point?
Ubaldo Jimenez is worth at least the top prospect in a team’s organization, worth likely the top two prospects. Of course, it’s what the market will bear for him but I think Dan O’Dowd will be patient and wait out the poker faces.
Rockies Prospects and Futures
Dan O’Dowd is either a horrible judge of talent or not very strong in negotiations, because we always get the lesser end of deals or fail to convince teams to take our players when we are ready to part with them. I have no confidence in O’Dowd to win a trade.
Sometimes the best trades are those not made. Hope this is a non-trade.
Tigers got a rhs from Seattle.
I hope that we don’t trade Ubaldo unless we get an incredible return for him which would involve starting pitchers and a 3B. I think that Ubaldo will be better next year. We do need to find a starting pitcher and a 3B, but I would be happy if we could trade a couple of our guys (one of the relievers, Spilly, or Wigginton, etc. and obtain a AAA starting pitcher and 3B ready to become a good major leaguer or a young major leaguer who is nonetheless an upgrade for us at starting pitcher (even if he is just a #4 or a #5) or 3B. I have to assume that there are several playoff contending teams who have young players who are stuck behind the guys on the major league teams. I’m not sure why we would trade for a catcher, given that we have Iannetta, if we think that Rosario will be readly to assume the job in a year, and I think that we don’t need outfielder prospects because of who we have in the minor league system, and we can make do at 2B with Ellis for next year (assuming that he will resign with us).
Trade Ubaldo, Stewart and Iannetta for Carlos Santana? Prog are you kidding me. Unless you mean the Santana who plays the guitar.