Rockies announce entire coaching staff will return for 2012
The Colorado Rockies announced Tuesday that the entire coaching staff will be retained for 2012 following a disappointing season in which the team collapsed from an 11-2 start to flirt with last place in the National League West during the final week of the season.
Along with Manager Jim Tracy, the Rockies the staff that will be returning next season:
- Bench coach: Tom Runnells
- Pitching coach: Bob Apodaca
- Hitting coach: Carney Lansford
- First base coach: Glenallen Hill
- Third base coach: Rich Dauer
- Bullpen coach: Jim Wright
- Catching coach: Marv Foley
With that, I announce that I am not bringing myself back as a season ticket holder.
Damn. Another year of mediocrity. I can live with Tracy returning, but what is the point in everyone else? Its clear the players tune them out in every aspect of the game.
Whatever saves the Monforts money is what they’ll go with.
I expected tracy to at least fire carney… he did no good to no hitter… even fowler had to go down to tripple A with the hitting coach down there to find out his leg kick…. carney its not the right hitting coach for.this team
No one did anything right this year. Everyone plays complacently and the team has no edge. The only thing that makes this season worse is when you remember they were spotted to an 11-2 record. Maybe we can make a run when Tracy gets fired in May.
What?? Please tell me it is not so. I’l like Matt has the correct response. On second thought – it’s only a game???!!!
All right yes Tracy needs to come back but Lansford and Apodaca staying?
Is anybody held accountable for this hapless season?
No other team in US pro sports reacts to such failure by maintaining the status quo.
I guess the 72-win season was primarily the fault of the two recently fired scouts.
A team underperforms for essentially 2 years and only wins 60 games over its last 150?? Prospects continuously come up here and flounder with most only regaining their form with stints of minor league coaaching (ie Dexter). Complete lack of passion over the last 6 weeks? If any manager and his staff deserved the ax its Tracy and company. His clubhouse is too cozy and this isn’t even a mediocre team anymore…
Supposedly the coaching staff was entirely in Jim Tracy’s hand. So I guess he is satisfied with the entire staff. Yeah it must have been those two scouts.
Milwaukee and Arizona are small market teams. If Tampa Bay makes the playoffs that’s another small market team. But I guess the Monferts and O’Dowd, along with Tracy think that the fans will put up with this horrible season of baseball. And maybe they are right. High attendance this year and after the last home game I saw fans behind the first base dugout giving Tracy a standing ovation. Why?
I’ll certainly think twice about spending my hard earned money at Coors. Except of course when my grandchildren are in town. See that’s the hold they have over us. Baseball is a great game, Coors is a great place to watch the game. But the ownership, the staff and the players need to do a better job.
Did this announcment come with an apology?
I want to know who the hell votes in the DP polls to retain Tracy? It sure isn’t the vocal crowd that posts here.
I learned this as an Army officer about 43 years ago: “There are no bad units; only bad leaders.” It has proven true in my subsequent business and public service activities. I believe it applies to sports teams, too.
With this announcement, an d the retention of Jim Tracy, Mr. O’Dowd has once and for all assumed complete responsibility for the failure of the Rockies this year, and for the team’s performance next year. By keeping Tracy, he has excused bad leadership. He cannot dodge the responsibility any longer.
Another dubious decision by the Rockies – Since they believe it wasn’t the coaching that was the problem, can we expect major turnover with the roster? I highly doubt it…
On Lansford: he gave himself credit for Helton’s bounceback season. I mean, I’m not buying that, but in a radio interview this summer he did it.
On Apodaca: I’ve got to say he had a pretty good record of success with out pitchers. Yeah, notable failures like Frankie Morales, but Ubaldo, Chacin, De La Rosa, Hammel, Belisle, even Cook can all give some credit to Apodaca. So I’m o.k. with that one. It’s not like some other pitching coach can take guys like Greg Reynolds and Clay Mortensen and make them good starters.
Glenallen Hill/Rich Dauer: not sure what they do or don’t do, so I have no basis to judge the decision to keep them.
Tom Runnels: ditto. His job is to be so dull that he makes Jim Tracy appear to be awake by comparison.
Yep I agree, my season ticket account will be terminated. If you are wanting another poor season next year then lets stay status quo. And that’s exactly what they have done. Well if you are happy with a bunch of underachieving quitters then I won’t be paying for that. I know my 1500 bucks a year isn’t much to a bunch of millionaires but at least I will have some more money for my ice cream habit. Too bad!!!!
What a flipping joke. We need to light a fire under these guys. Instead, lets just bring back the entire staff and all remain friends. At first I thought it was a good thing that we had such a cohesive team. However, I’ve seen how everyone is afraid to hold anyone accountable since everyone’s so “friendly”. Like I said, they need someone with some fire. Sad.
So Arizona wins 5 div titles in 14 years & the owners are constantly making Front Office & Mgr changes to achieve playoff goals, but again the Rocks stay pat…INEXCUSABLE, maybe a huge 80 win season next year. Definition of insanity is????
Agbayani, you might add Paulino to the list of Apodaca’s failures this year. I agree that Apodaca has had success in the past turning pitchers around. It didn’t seem to continue this year. More pitchers’ performances declined over the course of this season than improved. That might indicate a lack of performance on Apodaca’s part.
Given the teamwide lack of performance at a fundamental level (hitting, base running, etc.) it’s hard to imagine that no coach had any responsibility for any of that.
Steve and Jack, thanks for making this forum available to us. You are certainly not responsible for the 2011 debacle, and I hope others will continue to contribute. I’m ponying up another hundred in the hope that you can continue this great site, even in the face of widespread dissafection with the on-the-field product.
If it ain’t broke don’t fix it. Ergo, nothing is apparently wrong with this team, certainly not in the managerial and coaching positions. These 89 or 90 losses apparently just happen for no reason and a terrible season prompts no change. Does this happen any place else?
They really must think we as paying customers are Pavlovian dogs who’ll continue to show up for a horse…. team. One day they won’t have sold 37K for a mid-week summer game with the Pirates and maybe, just maybe, the Monforts will realize they’ve made some huge mistakes by not being more responsive to fed-up fans. I love having a team in Denver, but enough is enough.
The Rockies sure game out tonight with some excitement and appreciation for the coaching staff returning!!!!
Lets see, 7 playoff wins (plus a play in game) gave Hurdle 1 1/3 years of security. 1 playoff win gives Tracy over 2 years of security.
Makes sense to me.
Why is Lansford being grilled here? Because he caused some friction in the clubhouse with some hitters with his hard-nosed approach that required a “clear the air meeting” in June? That’s the problem with this team, it’s a country club atmosphere in the clubhouse. If someone comes in and disrupts that comfort zone, that person is the outcast. It’s the culture that’s been created in this organization. And anyone who thinks that Lansford is the problem, you are only being an apologist and an enabler for that culture that’s been created.
Speaking of culture and organizational expectations, Terry Francona will probably be fired when the Bosox complete their collapse and miss the playoffs. All he’s done is guided his team to two World Series championships and consistently keeps his team in playoff contention. Compare that with Tracy’s accomplishments since he’s been here. One manager will probably lose his job after this season and the other gets to come back along with his entire staff. The difference is the expectations of the fan base. Do you think the fans of Boston, NY, or Philly would accept this mediocrity that we’re seeing here in Denver?
I am with you all on the “just stunned” viewpoint. At this point I think we can determine the following:
1) This season was a series of unfortunate events, unlikely to recur, and so if we make small tinkerings at the edges, let our young guys develop, and fortune smiles on us next year could be a playoff year. I can see the argument, and it might be true and we are all eating crow this time next year but…there is an awful lot of assumptions there.
2) That they really believe the fanbase, aside from those of us called “vocal,” will stick with this team, that last year’s signings of CarGo and Tulo proove they have a plan and they are asking us to trust them. All I can say is they need to prepare for some loss this off-season (last off-season we were coming off a season where they got within 1 game of first in mid-September before fading, so there was reason for optomism), and they had better start 2012 on fire.
3) This should mean that Tracy does not get an extension this off-season. He has communicated that he is willing to hold fast with the cards he has. Aside from Carney, the staff doesnt seem a bad fit for baseball at altitude, and I can see Tulo’s point that you cannot change hitting coaches every year because it takes too long to learn their swings. But management cannot re-sign JT until this team demonstrates something next year – an extension at the AS Break if deserved, fine. But if the team falters at the start, Tracy has taken teh responsibility on himself by retaining the staff.
4) They will suprise us with at least one major upgrade, either in the rotation or in the line-up. If so, they know they can playcate the fanbase and get us to risk our emotions, time, and money again. But with so little quality in the FA market and many teams having holes, DOD is going to need to move fast if he is to do this.
All in all, just a horrible, no-good, awful season and thankfully it ends for the Rox tonight. Can I offer a “lets go Rox’s management” rather than “Go Rox” tonight?
I agree with you Cisco Kid. Most Rockies fans don’t even know what they’re doing or what’s going on when they go to Coors Field. This whole organization(FO, manager, coaches, players, fans) are just way too soft and are willing to accept mediocre baseball. Owners are happy as long as fans are coming to the ballpark, fans are just happy to be at Coors Field on a Friday night in Colorado, no one cares if we win or lose. I’m gonna guess that along with keeping the coaching staff they’ll pretty much keep the whole entire roster. I wouldn’t be surprised if we sign Aaron Cook to a cheap contract and give him a spot in the rotation. Ian Stewart will probably get another chance to be the starting 3B. I can’t wait for this season to end but I’m not really excited about next season though either.
“Do you think the fans of Boston, NY, or Philly would accept this mediocrity that we’re seeing here in Denver?”
Sox fans would love it. With the Rockies’ September record they’d be getting ready for the first round of the playoffs.
“Why is Lansford being grilled here? Because he caused some friction in the clubhouse with some hitters with his hard-nosed approach that required a “clear the air meeting” in June? ”
No, he’s getting grilled because the team can’t hit. How did the top 3 “special project” hitters do? (Fowler, Stewart, Iannetta)?
Usually a team like this cans a coach if only to show someone’s still awake at the switch. It may or may not be fair to the coach, but it’s not a good sign to do nothing, either.
I’m sure Dr C’s #3 is certainly the plan. If the team gets off to a slow start, Tracy will be gone.
Dr C and egossage, yeah, it’s gonna be a tough off-season. I’d imagine everyone’s hopeful for changes, but not too optimistic. I don’t think a high-impact addition is likely on the FA market due to what you get for the cost. So that means trades, and the Rockies don’t seem to have a lot of surplus at the moment. A little at catcher and bullpen, compred to holes at 2nd, 3rd, the rotation, and a ginormous sucking blackhole of a bench.
Great posts by everyone, and I have to agree with the general mood of disappointment in the entire staff coming back.
Philosophically, I like the approach Carney wants the hitters to take. What I do not like is the fact that they do not seem to pay attention to him.
In the DP today it mentioned that Apodaca was pleased that Pomeranz was listening to Apodaca’s trying to change his mechanics and balance. Why is Apodaca messing with this kids mechanics?
The other coaches I can give or take.
Tracy, I said this way early in the season, seemed to lose this team’s ear. Also, many of his managerial decisions were mind boggling and at times senseless.
I am not a fan of Tracy and Apodaca and do not understand their retention.
Konaman made a great statement in regards to AZ compared to the Rox.
I am not a season ticket holder so I cannot protest in that fashion, but I can refuse to attend games, refuse to buy merchandise that puts money in the Rox pockets, and voice my displeasure right here on the ITR.
Steve, Tracey, and Jack, thanks for this site and keep up the good work of giving us posters a place to vocalize.
Attendance in Arizona last night was 26k
Attendance at Coors last Tuesday? 32k
Granted, D’back fans are awful but we are sheep
I love how many here think they know what’s going on inside the clubhouse.
Look no further than the players for the reason for the bad season…most just need to grow the hell up and/or grow a pair.
Reader f/k/a Mike- How well did those three guys you mentioned do under the tutelage of Baylor last season? How well would they do under a new hitting coach?
My wife was a public school teacher for over 25 years, and she often came home complaining about these enabling and coddling parents who always placed the blame on the teachers for their child’s ineptitude. It didn’t matter what grade the kid was in, it was always the teacher’s fault. Sound familiar?
Its all about bang for your buck.
If you can get reaction out of the players by firing somebody, does it really matter what the reason for firing them was?
I don’t know.
I guess in the long run, if you dump the wrong guy and the positive reaction from the players is only temporary, I guess you can end up in a bad situation.
Look at what happened to Hurdle. Certain players pretty much caused Hurdle to get fired. They were just THAT BAD during 2008 and early 2009.
I guess O’Dowd must now believe that coaching isn’t really the problem. Well if that’s the case, will he step out and make someone the scape goat? Was Ubaldo the problem? Ian Stewart? Aaron Cook? Who is O’Dowd and the Monforts going to make accountable for the season?
If no one, then we better see a big improvement next year, otherwise his head should be on the chopping block as well.
You just can’t go in after a 90 loss season with minor changes and expect to compete.
Unreal news. The big dis-connect here is we are fans, the Monfort’s are businessmen. They see their business as profitable, so why change the business plan? I’m not saying they don’t want to win, of course they do. But they have a different perspective than we do. When nothing changes, then nothing changes. Count on another massively disappointing season next year. Now it’s our choice to support these losers or not.
It all makes me admire the D-Bax even more. The owner saw badness, and made the hard decisions to replace the whiners, and crybabies, get rid of the GM who coddled them, hired a hard nosed manager and look at the results, another division title. Maybe the D-Bax are recruiting fans. It wouldn’t be too hard to switch.
I just read this at mlb.com. It is Jack McKeon speaking about a manager’s job in getting on players. He was referencing Ozzie Guillen, new Marlins manager, who was McKeon’s 3rd base coach when Marlins won WS in 2003.
“If you let everybody continue to be non-productive, and you want to do that stuff, that’s not my job. My job is to jump you, make you better. Make you realize that this is the way to do it. It’s not going to be tolerated to be comfortable and not work at your job. If they think that is criticism, so be it.”
I don’t think that is part of Tracy’s attitude, nor the attitude of the coaches. It sure seems like the attitude of Gibson in AZ this year.
“This is like deja vu all over again.” Thanks, Yogi.
Disappointment doesn’t begin to cover the underachievement for this season. Ubaldo’s a bust but O’Dowd dumped him for one promising starter and possibly a second (though last night’s performance by White gives me great cause for concern.) So it’s too early to judge this move.
Can De la Rosa stay healthy? It appears not and at any rate he’s not a #1 starter anyway. I’m over Cook and probably Hammel too, his last 2 starts notwithstanding. The game starts with pitching and ours sucked this year. Blame whoever you want but when a 40 year old reject from Boston’s AAA team is our great “innings eater” hope we are in TROUBLE! DO’D had better bring in 40 prospects so that one or two will stick in ’12.
Hitting with runners in scoring position is the most team oriented statistic in the game. Ours is pathetic. I’m over Stewart, anyone who plays 2nd base, EY Jr., Spilly and most definitely Iannetta. If we can’t find people who can hit from the 6th hole on down at least .250 then it’s time to go back to being a AAA affiliate.
Cargo and Tulo must shoulder the greatest responsibility for the lack of offense. The must stay healthy for one and Cargo can’t hit 40 points below 2010. Expecting Helton at almost 40 to protect your # 4 hitter is a bit much. Can anyone say power bat?
So Santa, please bring me a power hitting 3rd baseman and left fielder. Find me a catcher who can hit .275 or even .260 and ditto that for 2nd base. Lastly a #1 starter would be nice. PS – be kind to Todd this winter. He’s like a nice buck for his trophy case, just don’t let him trip when he’s bringing it home.
As to coaches – Tracy is safe until June 1st beyond that who knows. If Carney is chewing butt, well that’s his nature but it had better show results or he’s gone too. Bob A has a thankless job in this altitude and its the guys throwing the pill who bear the ultimate responsibility. Be mature enough to know your limitations and “pitch” don’t throw. As Yogi said, “Baseball is 90% mental — the other half is physical.” Pitching is as much between the ears as it is in the arm.
So to borrow a phrase from my Cubs lov’in brother; “wait till next year.” Out!
I,m almost speechless,but am surprised at so little venom being directed at O’Dowd.No matter who coaches,the pieces must be present to be molded.I don’t like Tracy’s coaching style,but one could argue he didn’t have the pieces-especially after the injurys started piling up.Just think of the difference signing Willingham instaed of Wigginton could have made to the offense.Prog,you’re comparing the D-backs to Rockies is very insightful.They’ve been in the playoffs a bunch,but don’t stand pat when things fall apart.Could be why they are repeatedly bouncing back to the top.I would love to see Dan ODed gone in favor of Jerry DiPoto,and then Ryne Sandberg in place of Tracy[if he hasn't been grabbed by the White Sox]!
DOD let Tracy pick his own staff alright, then how did Glen Allen Hill make the cut. i guess Allen’s sponsor in the front office kept it alive for him…..Trinidad Hubbard was the man for that job, teaches baserunning and outfield play. Does Allen even know what a fungo bat is.
I definately wouldn’t let DOD off the hook. Most of his draft choices have not panned out. The only impact player that we have drafted in our first round has been Tulo (slam dunk pick when Seattle passed on him and took Jeff Clement earlier) and all the rest of our impact players our from the Latin American program or trade (CarGo).
I remember the last days of Clint- benching Tulo for swinging at the first pitch at a game at the Marlins I believe. At that point I said- “He lost the team. If he can’t get them to listen and has to grasp at straws to get them to listen (benching you best player 40 games in) he can no longer be effective.” I see the same thing happening to Tracy. All year he talks about players needing to take professional at-bats, but all I see is players swinging from their heels with men on or two strikes. Then at the end of the year he goes off in a post-game about how the players aren’t taking good at-bats. Game 155 is not the time to start calling the players out- game 1 was. And it should have been meaningful, and behind closed doors, not the passive way Tracy has.
Hoping for a bat and an arm for 2012, Tulo to realize he doesn’t have to hit a homer every time he bats after the 6th inning, and an old-school manager that has the backing of the org (or tracy to start acting like one). No more Street- “I don’t mind pitching with guys on base”, Cook (too bad he couldn’t be effective), Wiggington (see bad at-bats above), Stewart (can’t handle the expectations), and Spilly (sad that he will probably be gone, but after his performance I can’t balme them).
You want acountability? I would start with Jay E. Alves, Walker Monfort, Marc Gustafson and probably to some extent Chris Warren and their associated staff.
Also, I have to wonder if anyone within the Rockies organization is capable of figuring out what position Pacheco plays or will the “jack of all trades, master of none” continue with him. I totally hate this current super utility model the Rockies have seemed to adopted.
I don’t think picking 1 position and sticking with it would make Pacheco a master at it.
His best quality is his bat. But its probably not good enough to beat out a very good player at 1 position… so I think the only way he’s ever going to be a constant with this team is to be versatile.
So for Pacheco I would keep him at the Super U, but to make sure he gets consistent ABs against left handers.
Prog, to me it just means the Rockies player development staff have no clue. Again I will refer to the article that Jack Etkin wrote about Pacheco.
At that time they believed he didn’t have the skills to be a true 2nd baseman and moving him to catcher was best. He had a total of 5 games at 3rd prior to bringing him up. If the Rockies believe he can’t play 2nd why would he be much better at 3rd? What happened to all the things mentioned in the article about why he was a better fit as a catcher?
Yes I understand that they wanted both Rosario and Pacheco in the lineup everyday and they both couldn’t catch. That just made me try to rationalize why they signed Kouzmanoff so late in the season.
I guess I will have to wait until spring to see what happens. To me it looks like Pacheco will not displace Rosario at catcher. Maybe they should get Pacheco playing 1st base? The inevitable is coming. Hopefully Todd’s back will be good to go for next season but you never know. Why not see how Pacheco plays 1st during the spring?
Who knows how and what players might be moved during the offseason but having a stockpile of second basemen, that apparently the Rockies are not happy with at 2nd, and try to turn them into some utility role is not the answer. If it was I think the Rockies would have had more than 73 wins.
There is a reason the Rays and the Dbacks are in the playoffs. If you just look at the fewest errors the Rays are ranked #2. If you combine fewest errors along with fewest walks given up then the Dbacks are ranked 3rd and the Rays 4th.
Payroll doesn’t mean squat when you have players that can play THEIR position and a pitching staff that doesn’t give up a bunch of walks.
“Reader f/k/a Mike- How well did those three guys you mentioned do under the tutelage of Baylor last season? How well would they do under a new hitting coach? ”
Well, Fowler went down to AAA and came back hitting better. Stewart hit like a pitcher. Iannetta did better this season, but I didn’t think he had that much of a problem to begin with.
The issue is the team made a lot of noise about how those three players were key and had to improve. They also made a lot of noise about strikeouts and how Lansford was brought in to improve the team by having hitters take different approaches.
The team did not improve offensively, and actually got a little worse.
Understand what I was responding to–you complaining Lansford being grilled for ruffling feathers. My response, no, he’s being grilled for being the hitting coach of a bad team.
Is it necessarily fair to fire him? No, esp. as he’s had just one year, and some of these guys aren’t good hitters to begin with. However, are hitting coaches on bad teams commonly fired to help change a bad culture of hitting? Yes.
As for your wife, do you really want to take this into a personal realm? Sometimes it’s the kid, sometimes it’s the parent, sometimes it’s the teacher, often it’s a bit of all these parts.
IIRC Pacheco was moved to catcher not because they thought it was necessarily his best position, but that it might be the most apt position in conjunction with his bat. Good hands, good arm, but not enough range for the middle infield, and not the power you want out of a corner spot.
There are players who can play 3rd due to quick hands and a good first step but who lack the overall quickness (range) and athleticism needed for the middle infield. And teams are a bit more willing to tolerate a below-avg glove at 3rd than 2nd/short. So that could play into the decision to start playing him at 3rd (along with organizational need/desperation), despite his being unsuited for a regular role at 2nd.
I’m guessing the biggest issue with Pacheco is he lacks great tools and thus never projected to be a top player. So the Rockies’ staff has brought him along as a utility player, thinking that is his best chance of making a contribution at the major league level. E.g,. if being able to play multiple positions gives the incentive to keep him on the roster long enough to find out if his contact hitting can help (either as a semi-regular, or as a righty pinch hitter), then it’s worth it.